The following, found in comments, is a freaking neat analogy regarding vibe-coded awful sorrowful nonsense out there…
- Benjamin Burnley makes gaming mods?! The f*ck? That’s awesome!
- Well he vibe codes gaming mods. idk if i would say he makes them. ~ That_Cripple
- He made it. Constructed it. Whatever you want to call it. You didn’t. Vibe coding isn’t doing nothing.
- He ordered it. When I order a steak at a steakhouse that doesn’t make me a chef. ~ SpacePrezSource: https://redd.it/1w9vfue (Benjamin Burnley interrupts a Breaking Benjamin concert with a rant about his True First Person 1.2 Fallout 4 mod…)
Meanwhile, of course, the music/art of the Breaking Benjamin, the Fallout Community, and the art around all the Universes, including The Elder Scrolls, Starfield, Fallout… of the artists/developers at Bethesda, Zenimax, Id… is infinitely, ineffably magnificent…
Related: https://lemmy.world/post/51702807 (Breaking Benjamin frontman pauses concert to rant about Fallout 4 modding beef…)
There’s a fine line maybe.
If you go to a shitty rated restaurant and ask to prepare a steak that meets certain procedures and requirements, and they bring it to you to test it, and you send back with corrections, repeatedly till it resembles a quality cooked meal… then you are somewhat a chef.
It’s an old debate, like when the camera was invented (while artists were painting landscaoes in the field) and could make perfect landscape pictures…is the photographer an artist?
It’s a tool.
If you just pump out slop and don’t curate anything then its just garbage slop; because its still slop automata at this stage.
I went through this this weekend. I have a bash script I wrote years ago to unlock my WD backup drive in Linux. I’m not a programmer, I just know the process and searched forums and stackexchange till I could cobble together a script that would do a few simple things.
- check if a WD drive is connected
- ask if you are setting a new password or using old one
- branch to cooking a password file or branch to unlocking the drive
- send command to drive with encryoted password binary.
- report back success or errors
So, did I make that script or did stackexchange?
Then this weeknd I wanted a GUI for it…but I know way less about GUI programming, so I fed my script into an LLM and asked for a GTK interface. It took my code and rewrote it for a dialog interface. It took six attempts to get it working with me guiding it. It added a few features on its own that I hadn’t thought of, and were actually good choices.
- is password.bin the proper format/character byte length check
- file browser if you wanted to pick the password out of a state directory, or send it direct
I feel I made more of the bash script than the GUI program. But both were done by using tools and tweaks
Does ordering from Subway make me a chef? I’m prompting the employee to assemble the sandwich I want, after all.
If you helped them cook the bread and meat properly ?? Subway is a bit different because you could automate this completely and just use a terminal to order toppings
You don’t help the chatbot cook your code properly either, you prompt it to cook it for you.
Vibe coding is not coding. It’s ordering a sandwich.
I think we’re getting hung up on the chef thing. The point is, you’ve eaten. You can eat well by cooking it yourself or by going to a good restaurant with an amazing chef.
Conversely if you eat microwaved meals all week, or live off drive through food, your food was technically made by a chef, but you may not live past 50.
LLMs in society are a very complex thing. The core technology isn’t evil. The capitalist-overdrive approach is mental. And the unregulated way it is introduced into society is irresponsible.
Once you understand that this is a probabilistic tool that with some tinkering can run locally, and should not be trusted as a deterministic tool for research, fact finding or calculations, you have a tool you can use for something in addition to several other tools.
No, I think the chef thing is literally the point.
I think we’re getting hung up on the chef thing. The point is, you’ve eaten.
No, that wasn’t the topic at all. The topic was about him being the creator or not. Stay on topic.
Your point is valid, but in another context, to be clear.
Yep. There’s a spectrum of how involved people are when they vibecode.
I think the biggest difference I’ve seen is in whether someone still understands how it works and chose that architecture for a reason. A lot of coworkers I’ve had that vibecode don’t understand their own code, and you can tell that’s what’s hurting them the most when it comes to performance and bugs. They don’t know the performance is way worse than it should be, and don’t understand how to even find and fix bugs, or that it has them.
They might have asked for the right features early on but it quickly becomes unmaintainable if they don’t choose architecture with purpose and read the code they didn’t write.
A hammer is also a tool, but if a hammer could do 100% of the work of building a house and all I had to do was press a button on it, I would not consider myself a construction worker.
If I comission a piece of art, I am not considered the artist even if they went entirely off a description for the art I wrote.
What you did with your script is assemble smaller scripts you didn’t do together. The composition is what you actually made
With AI, you do vet on the composition. You say yes to adding code.
To take the other commenter’s analogy, before you asked for the raw ingredients at subway to make your sandwich, now you let the cashier do it. It may be the same way as you would have, but it’s not you that made any of it. You made the concept, not the physical result
Subway should actually just be a conveyor system and a terminal let’s you pick toppings. And plops out a sandwich at the end. I assume underpaying humans is cheaper than investing in assembly line is cheaper for the franchise owner though
